Posts by Mad Dawg

347

Must see video on Youtube where a JW is clearly defeated on the trinity subject...

by Tuesday in

personally i hate bible ping-pong.

i don't think it ever gets anywhere, i don't think it solves anything and i don't think the participants ever make any head room.

however i will say in this case, i have been proven wrong.

Mad Dawg

Pilchard, my friend. Are you agreeing that you are a polytheist?

As far as I can tell the WTS beliefs only precede the NWT by, at most, about 80 years, and many came after the NWT. Is this what you consider a long time?

113

Topics for discussion with JWs - part 3: Homosexual animals...

by Albert Einstein in

jw
friends

god hates homosexuality very very much ... right?.

being wicked homosexual ... you are to be destroyed in armageddon ... right?.

people were created by god as heterosexual, but some are today homosexual as a result of imperfection - punishment for disobedience of adam a eve..... but why there is so much homosexuality among god created animals?

Mad Dawg

Any evidence of this ever happening?

Any evidence of a rape victim being forced to live with the perpetrator?

She was aware of the plot to get him home to sleep with her, therefore I would venture to say she would be aware of the other plot as well.

Read the verses. Uriah did not go home. Verses 9, 10 and 13 specifically say so. There is nothing to indicate she knew anything about any plot. There is no reason to believe that she had any knowledge of him being in the area.

9 But Uriah slept at the entrance to the palace with all his master's servants and did not go down to his house. 10 When David was told, "Uriah did not go home," he asked him, "Haven't you just come from a distance? Why didn't you go home?" 11 Uriah said to David, "The ark and Israel and Judah are staying in tents, and my master Joab and my lord's men are camped in the open fields. How could I go to my house to eat and drink and lie with my wife? As surely as you live, I will not do such a thing!" 12 Then David said to him, "Stay here one more day, and tomorrow I will send you back." So Uriah remained in Jerusalem that day and the next. 13 At David's invitation, he ate and drank with him, and David made him drunk. But in the evening Uriah went out to sleep on his mat among his master's servants; he did not go home. (NIV)

Do you think the people would question a King capable of the atrocities David had committed, or who was considered a national hero like David was?

Yes. It was all about David saving face.

You're telling me Israelites were ignorant of premature babies?

You’re telling me Israelites were ignorant of the difference between a full-term and a premature baby? If the baby had been 8 or 9 pounds, it would have been obvious that it was not a premature baby. He didn’t want to take the chance. Especially if he was going to present the baby to the priest, before the public, when the child was 8 days old.

Killing someone vs. lying, which is easier to get away with... I'm still going to go with lying as being far easier to pull off than murder.

Not necessarily, not in this case. The issue in David’s case was not whether or not he would get caught, but who would know. David was very concerned about what others thought of him. He was trying to get rid of the one person who did know so that others would not find out.

A sociological understanding is in order here. Shame, in any culture is a very powerful, painful thing to endure. People will go to great lengths to avoid it or relieve themselves of it.

In shame cultures, if one is shamed, that individual is highly motivated to get rid of the source of the shame. This is why honor killings and ritual suicide are common occurrences in honor/shame societies. It does not matter to the person that is shamed if the one killed is actually innocent. David was willing to go to any length to avoid being shamed. He decided to swat the fly with a sledgehammer.

Your assumptions about what would happen in the case of David are built on the paradigm of one who comes from a guilt society. The assumptions of a guilt culture paradigm do not apply to a shame culture. If one is going to make assumptions about the actions of ancient people, they should first study how the ancients thought, what motivated them, and how the culture at large would view the actions in question.

Shame-	Other people believe:
culture	Other people believe:
I believe	I didn't do it	I did it
I didn't do it	No problem	I am shamed and dishonored by their belief
I did it	No-one knows, so I am not shamed	I am guilty and am punished


Guilt-	Other people believe:
culture	Other people believe:
I believe	I didn't do it	I did it
I didn't do it	No problem	I protest my innocence and fight the accusation
I did it	I am expected to feel guilty regardless	I am guilty and am punished

347

Must see video on Youtube where a JW is clearly defeated on the trinity subject...

by Tuesday in

personally i hate bible ping-pong.

i don't think it ever gets anywhere, i don't think it solves anything and i don't think the participants ever make any head room.

however i will say in this case, i have been proven wrong.

Mad Dawg

Ren my dear,

I am getting more confused than ever, please help me here.

To be honest I accept only the bible as authority on talking about things that are purely speculation if the bible doesn't say it.

Do you realize that you said here that the Bible is your only authority on things it doesn’t talk about?

throughout history a small numbers of earnest bible followers have kept believing

Please name these folks. Please provide source stating that Newton was a unitarian. Are you suggesting that Newton also held to the rest of WTS doctrine? Are you aware that Charles Russel was never baptized?

isaac polytheism is worshiping many gods

Ren, if I may, you are a bit off on your definition of polytheism.

Polytheism

Pol"y*the*ism\, n. [Poly- + Gr. ? cf. F. polyth['e]isme.] The doctrine of, or belief in, a plurality of gods.

polytheism

The belief in more than one god. The ancient Greeks, for example, were polytheists; their gods included Apollo , Athena , Dionysus , and Zeus . (Compare monotheism .)

The American Heritage® New Dictionary of Cultural Literacy, Third Edition
Copyright © 2005 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

The thing here is not how many gods a person worships, but how many he believes exists. Greek and Roman pagans believed that many gods existed but typically they chose one god and worshipped that one exclusively – same as JW’s claim to do now. By the standard of the actual definition of the word, JW’s are polytheists. You can call a tail a leg, but that don’t make it so.

the biggest flaw is the bible never says 3 equals one, only men do.

The Bible never states the following, only men do:

Ø Paradise earth

Ø ONLY 144K are going to Heaven

Ø Theocratic organization

Ø Governing Body

Ø Jerusalem fell 607 years before the common era

Ø Pioneers

The above are all examples of where the WTS invented words or “…twist MAN-MADE rhetoric to try and fit around ...” their own ideas.

NOWHERE ABSOLUTELY NOWHERE IN THE BIBLE DOES IT SAY 3 in ONE!

I’d love for you to state with a straight face that the WTS only uses words and phrases found in the Bible.

Ren, thank you for your input. It is interesting, but I am getting more confused from what you are saying. Please help clarify this.

MD

155

I'm Craving Head Cheese

by snowbird in

it's also called souse.. there was a show on radio this morning about farm life, and a caller told how it's done.. my mother used to make a big container for xmas.. i'm really waxing nostalgic here.. sylvia.

Mad Dawg

Cajun head cheese, that sounds like it is worth a try. How would it be listed on a restaraunt's menu?

Head cheese is not as finely ground as potted meat, which is more similar to a hotdog.

33

Guilt trip on R&F if you don't preach

by bobld in

jw
friends

there is a certain feeling in the air,that you must preach and to knock on doors.they like to as an example,if you know that there's a tornado or some bad weather is coming and you don't say anything or warn the people,you bear resonsibility for the lives lost.the wbts looks at it the same way.thus the gulit trip for not going from door to door.. now this is about as stupid as a queer in a whorehouse.the gb of the wbts should be guilty of not warning the people,by modern technology methods.they should be using,t.v.,radio,internet,satellite etc.not this bull dung of going from door to door.how would they like it if a tornado hit their new printery in wallkill,n.y.

and the government sent troops form door to door to warn their volunteer workers.how about their properties in brooklyn,n.y.

so don't give me this guilt story of preaching from door to door as the most effective.just look at the history of how many people lost their lives in the past due to tornados because they did not have the modern technology of warning people as compared to today.get off you high horse and if you think your message is so important to warn people than use the proper methods.. bob.

Mad Dawg

Ren my dear,

Do you think that if Jesus and His apostles were here today they would be handing out Watch Towers? Do you think that they did it in their own time? Does the modern inventions you disparage include printing presses?

MD

155

I'm Craving Head Cheese

by snowbird in

it's also called souse.. there was a show on radio this morning about farm life, and a caller told how it's done.. my mother used to make a big container for xmas.. i'm really waxing nostalgic here.. sylvia.

Mad Dawg

The stuff has a different, but not strong flavor. I would enjoy it, but I don't like the texture of it.

347

Must see video on Youtube where a JW is clearly defeated on the trinity subject...

by Tuesday in

personally i hate bible ping-pong.

i don't think it ever gets anywhere, i don't think it solves anything and i don't think the participants ever make any head room.

however i will say in this case, i have been proven wrong.

Mad Dawg

Pilchard said:

So VERY CLEARLY the Christians have ONLY ONE God out of the
VERY MANY gods that exist, both in name only and genuine bonafide gods.

Ummm, Pilchard, are you a Mormon? Seriously. This is exactly what Mormons teach. That there are many gods, but we only have one of the many for ourselves. Are you or have you ever been a JW? You do realize that if you believe that if there are many gods, regardless of whether or not we worship them, you are a polytheist, right?

22

Summary of JW Beliefs

by jonathan dough in

many jws are unfamiliar with the jw's beliefs.

after considerable research i have discovered the following.. .

the jehovahs witnesses believe that only 144,000 people go to heaven (reasoning from the scriptures (reasoning) [new york, watchtower bible and tract society, 1985], 166).

Mad Dawg

Thank you, JD and welcome!! Your post is very helpful.

347

Must see video on Youtube where a JW is clearly defeated on the trinity subject...

by Tuesday in

personally i hate bible ping-pong.

i don't think it ever gets anywhere, i don't think it solves anything and i don't think the participants ever make any head room.

however i will say in this case, i have been proven wrong.

Mad Dawg

Ren, my dear.

Your understanding of the terms indicate that you don't know what you are arguing against. Your response to Isaac belies your understanding of the historical Christian view of the trinity. Only two of the terms refer to different views of the trinity. The third term is related to a concept related to one of the two views.

There are many theories about Jesus and unitarianism. Using your standard, rejecting the multiple theories, I would have to reject unitarianism (many versions) in favor of trinitarianism (two versions). If you wish to claim that trinitarianism includes more than two lines of thought, please list them. I would be very interested at looking into them.

You can use a Catholic, Baptist, Presbytarian or any other theological dictionary you wish. In fact, why don't you use a WT dictionary? They should define the terms even if they disagree with them.

If one only needs to go to the Bible, why do JW's spend so much time reading WT publications? If all we need is the Bible, show me where it says that blood fractions are acceptable or a matter of conscience. Show me where it says not to vote. Show me where is says that Jesus and Michael are the same person. That the faithful have to fill out time slips. Or that Jerusalem fell 607 years before the common era from the Bible only. It strikes me as hypocritical for the WT to point out that "trinity" or some other term is not in the Bible when so many of their own terms are not in the Bible: "paradise earth," Kingdom Hall," "pioneer," and so forth.

You would have a much easier time on this subject if you were to argue against what trinitarians are actually claiming instead of arguing against the WT caricature of the trinity.

Thank you for your responses. They are much appreciated.

MD

347

Must see video on Youtube where a JW is clearly defeated on the trinity subject...

by Tuesday in

personally i hate bible ping-pong.

i don't think it ever gets anywhere, i don't think it solves anything and i don't think the participants ever make any head room.

however i will say in this case, i have been proven wrong.

Mad Dawg

Ren my dear, do you understand the difference between modalism and ontological equality? Do you know what functional subordination is?